Itinerary advice / quote

Roalloophoull18

Guete Morge,

My wife and I are planning to visit Switzerland and France during December.
So, we’re carefully quoting all the most expensive stuff, that includes transportation.

That’s why I want to ask your help on how to quote the following itinerary:

From: Closest station to hotels at Bern Expo (Marriott) // To: Interlaken OST.
From: Interlaken OST // To: Closest station to hotels at Bern Expo (Marriott).
From: Closest station to hotels at Bern Expo (Marriott) // To: Paris, CDG Airport.
From: Paris, CDG Airport // To: Switzerland, Zurich Airport.

I’ve read about the Half-Day and Swiss-Pass, although I’m not sure if those apply for inter-country train travels such as from Bern to Paris? - also I didn’t found any SBB train service from Bern to Paris.

Your help would be highly appreciated.

Danhiel

Roalloophoull18 Guten Tag

Do you mean the Moxy Hotel in Bern? The closest station is Bern Wankdorf. You have often trains to Bern (main station).

If you make a day trip to Interlaken, I think that a Saver Day Pass could be a good idea, Choose the full price and not the half price.

https://www.sbb.ch/en/tickets-offers/tickets/day-passes/saver-day-pass.html

If you stay in Interlaken more as one day, Supersaver Tickets could be available, search the timetable to find the prices and the conditions.

To and from Paris, it is better to travel via Basel. You will also find discounted prices with some restrictions in the timetable.

Please note that tickets and reservations are probably not available now for December, you should try later if you get an error message.

Kind Regards
Danhiel

Roalloophoull18

Danhiel Guten Tag,

I am learning along the way while I plan for this trip, so your help and detailed response are really appreciated!

I can see that distance between Bern’s Moxy Hotel and Bern Wankdorf station is just about 2 miles, this hotel is in a good spot!

Now, regarding the Saver Day Pass (Full-Price), I’ve found it for 39.00 CHF, and it last from one day till 5am of the next day.
What are the benefits of getting one of this Saver Day Pass? - like does it allow me to hop into any SBB train and buses as needed, or is it just a discount?

The plan is growing as days go by, but initially it would be one day at Interlaken, one day in Bern and then taking a train to Paris.
However, per your advice, it seems like for going to Paris it would be better off for us to take a train to Basel and from there to Paris, right?
Also, does the Saver Day Pass give me benefits for traveling from Bern to Basel to Paris?

Last but not least, as you may noticed, I’m handling this trip really carefully, and there are many reasons, and one of them being budget, so if you could share some details on what are the pros and cons of the Saver Day Pass vs SuperSaver Tickets, then who knows?, we might go one more day to Interlaken, but need to carefully assess if it’s budget-friendly!

Thanks for your help!

RedBaron

Why would you want to travel just to Interlaken, and not beyond?
What do you expect to see there in walking distance from the train stations?

Roalloophoull18

RedBaron Guten Tag,

Thanks for your reply.

I’ve seen many different forums about the natural wonders and scenery of Interlaken.
Plus, as I’ve mentioned before, budget is a variable I always take seriously, this trip not being the exception, even more after reading the Switzerland is among the most expensive nations in the world.

Now, given that we’re shaping the plan for this trip as days go by, and since it seems you have good proposals beyond Interlaken, if you could share some of them with me that would be appreciated.

I would like to stay in Bern’s Moxy Hotel, and from there use public transportation to move around (like going to Interlaken) - taking advantage of Switzerland’s famous public transportation service - so given those conditions, could you please share some other places we can visit in a span of 3 days?

Thanks for your help.

Danhiel

Roalloophoull18 Guten Tag

The hotel is near the station Bern Wankdorf, not 2 miles away. You can be on the platform in 5 minutes.

You have also an Ibis Hotel who could be cheaper as the Moxy Hotel, 15 minutes walk to the station Bern Wankdorf, 4 minutes with the tram. You can also take the tram directly to the main station (16 minutes).

I suggest to stay in Bern and to buy Saver Day Passes for the days between your arrival and your departure. With these passes, you can hop into any train and bus as needed in Switzerland, not only SBB, except some mountain excursions.

With a Supersaver Ticket, it is not possible to use other trains. With a Saver Day Pass, you can change your plans, for example you can choose another destination if the weather is bad in the Alps.

Yes, it would be better to take a train to Basel and from there to Paris. You have also some relations with local trains until Neuchâtel and Frasne, but I think that it easier to change in Basel. The station of Frasne is very “rustic”. Some relations could be cheaper, but you must take a regional train from Basel to Mulhouse or Strasbourg and change again. It is also possible to travel via Lausanne or Geneva.

On sbb.ch, you can find global prices between Bern and Paris who also include a discount in Switzerland.

RedBaron

Roalloophoull18
First of all, you won’t find any natural wonders IN Interlaken (maybe excepted Harder Kulm, the local mountain peak accessible via funicular), they’re located AROUND Interlaken and it can take up to another 2 hours to finally get there. Second, December is not the best season for the Bernese Oberland area, unless you’re an avid skier and the snow conditions are already permitting that. In other words, everything related to hiking (free of charge!), wildflowers, green sceneries, animals or waterfalls/gorges (ice on footpaths) will be closed or not accessible then.

What will be operating with a high probability are destinations like Jungfraujoch or Schilthorn (= typical reasons why most tourist are getting to Interlaken as a hub or accomodation), but they’re a) pretty expensive (up to 4x more expensive than your regular Bern-Interlaken ticket) and b) weather dependent (snow storms, clearing of tracks, avalanche risks, or simply the peaks covered in clouds so you’d only see some very expensive fog up there).

So you should first decide about your final destination given the conditions to expect. Lots of websites and Google will help you with that. Maybe the Harder Kulm might be not the worst idea given the weather related and “financial” risks. However that particular peak at 1320m altitude might also be completely covered in a clouds/fog layer while the sun is shining higher up, which is a quite common “inversion” weather situation during winter.

Addendum: Forget about Schilthorn, the “James Bond” cable car up there is getting replaced between october and march and therefore not operating this particular winter season.

Roalloophoull18

Danhiel Guten Tag,

Thanks for your guidance.

The Moxy Hotel I picked up because of a loyalty points program - using points helps a lot saving some money.

Even before this forum I thought on Bern as an strategic point for our eventual stay in Switzerland, but having you advising this makes it sound even more as good choice.

I’m going to be honest, I’m starting to feel a bit discouraged about going to Switzerland or Europe during December, and pretty much any month except between May till October, due to most of the comments I’ve read aren’t any favorable, beyond skiing.

Despite of that, for deciding on move forward with the trip or not, I wish if you could provide your advice on the following:

I’m a bit confused with what is the advantage of buying a Swiss Pass (Full-Price) with respect to buying standalone one-way tickets from Bern to say Interlaken or going downtown in Bern?, I just know that the Swiss Pass (Full-Price) costs 39CHF, but by buying it does it mean I get a discount on the whole price of the normal cost of a ticket, if so then what percentage of discount I get?, or it is that I can hop on as many trains and buses of any of Switzerland’s public transportation (excepting tours) for just 39CHF?
I’m assuming that Switzerland’s public transportation (SBB, etc) are used to moderate to heavy snow and that the service is reliable, of course with qualified exceptions such as very adverse climate conditions, is this accurate?, I mean if there are 4 train travels to/from Bern/Interlaken those 4 train travels have a great chance of being met?
Do you consider Interlaken being a good place to visit during December? - despite of snow and mist? - are there restaurants, stores, Christmas shops and so on open or are most of them expected to be closed 24/7 during December?
If the climate is adverse in Interlaken, are there any good outdoors hiking with nice landscapes - of course snowy - if we decided to stay at Bern that day?
In case of snowy weather, do museums and art exhibitions and other indoor places remain open at Bern or Zurich? - Zurich being where we would be spending our last vacations day.

Your help is highly appreciated!

Roalloophoull18

RedBaron Guten Tag,

Thanks for your reply.

Now I’m starting to feel a bit discourage about visiting Switzerland.
I read that kind of comments from a bunch of forums, that’s why I came here to ask to the extend of stressing out our on-develop plan to visit Switzerland.

I didn’t expect to see wildflowers, green sceneries or wild animals on December since winter season is starting, although I did expect to be able to found places where we could have a relax hiking while seeing a nice landscape (covered in snow, certainly).

As I’ve just mentioned on this post, I know what to not expect, although what I was at least expecting may not be likely to occur.

And before reaching here naturally I went to Google, that’s why I built up some questions, which you guys helped me working around them.

I’m not giving up on this trip, yet, but I’m going to keep learning as most as possible to take the best decision.

Thanks for all your help!

Danhiel

Hello Roalloophoull18

Sorry, but I think that you have a false idea of Switzerland. This is not a postcard with sunny snowy landscapes everywhere. The weather is unpredictable, you have sometimes too much snow or sometimes not enough. It were better in January or February.

It can happen, but it is rare, that train lines are closed due to bad weather.

Stores are generally closed only on Sundays, museums only on Mondays. You can find a lot of Christmas Markets in December. In the big cities, most restaurants are also closed on Sundays, but you can always find fast food…

The Saver Day Passes are only available in advance and are not exchangeable and not refundable. The prices and the availability are unpredictable, they could change every day. Alternatives are the Swiss Travel Pass or the Swiss Travel Pass Flex:

https://www.sbb.ch/en/tickets-offers/tickets/guests-abroad/swiss-travel-pass.html

Roalloophoull18

Danhiel Guten Tag!,

I started to realize my perception of Switzerland might be somewhat influenced by television and books!, appreciate you guys helping out to give a more realistic view of this wonderful country and caveats related to weather.

This is going to be a nice adventure that my wife and I are looking forward to do!
There are plenty of alternatives, ranging from museums, Christmas markets, etc, not to mention other great stuff which I would definitely like to try like Jungfrau rail train (which includes cable-car commute of about 15 minutes), and going to other nice places by using the great benefits of the Swiss Pass Travel - very likely buying a couple 3-days tickets.

Now, about Jungfrau, do you know if the 139CHF that costs the tickets starting from Interlaken OST covers a roundtrip?, my guess is yes but I wouldn’t want to reach the “Top of Europe” to realize that we need to pay another 139CHF/each for going back to Interlaken OST and from there to our headquarters in Bern! - I’m also guessing that the cable-car commute is relaxed and 15-minutes long and that the winds doesn’t make the car swing heavily? (not a huge fan of feeling unstable!)

And last but not least, about the Glacier Express, for buying tickets the webpage prompted to the Tickets for Switzerland Public Transportation, does that mean that a Saver Day Pass and Swiss Travel Pass include the benefit of traveling on the Glacier Express, no extra charges, by just paying for the Pass fare? - for instance, as of today, 244CHF is the cost of the Swiss Travel Pass for 3 days for a single ticket, so I can board without any other charge the Glacier Express and take even the whole route of 8 hours long?

Thanks for your help!

Danhiel

Guten Tag Roalloophoull18

If you have a Swiss Travel Pass, you could use one day to go to Grindelwald Terminal or Wengen. After these stations, you need a ticket with a discount of 25% to the Jungfraujoch. I cannot give you more informations, the site is now unavailable:

jungfrau.ch

If you want only try a cable car, you could go to Mürren, this is included in the Swiss Travel Pass or the Saver Day Pass, for example Interlaken - Lauterbrunnen - cable car (4 minutes) - train - Mürren. It were possible to take another route from Interlaken to Bern via Lucerne for the return trip.

The Glacier Express is included in the Swiss Travel Pass or a Saver Day Pass, but a mandatory reservation is required:

www.glacierexpress.ch

If you take only regional trains, this is the same line but without panoramic cars and catering, you don’t need any reservation. From Bern you could see only a part of the line, for example Bern - Brig - Andermatt - Göschenen - Lucerne - Bern, or Bern - Brig - Andermatt - Chur - Zürich - Bern. I don’t think that you have enough time to go to Zermatt and return from St. Moritz in one day.

Roalloophoull18

Danhiel Guten Tag!,

My apologies for such a long delay getting back to the forum - no excuses, it just has been busy days.

I’ve got tickets for early November.
It seems like weather would be cloudy in the valleys but may get sunny as going uphill, although not as chilly as in December, and scenery would be orange-cladded instead of snowy given is autumn, so it sounds good as well!

The plan is to get the Swiss Half Fare Pass before reaching Zurich.
As we arrive to Zurich we want to take a train that take us to Bern, as close as possible to the Bern’s Moxy Hotel - do you know if there’s a train stop that leave us at walking distance to the hotel?
There we would spend our first day, and we would be staying at that hotel during our 4-days tenure in Switzerland.

For the second day we’re planning to go to Jungfraujoch.
It seems that a train from Bern to Interlaken OST takes over an hour, and with the Swiss Half Fare Pass it would be a around 129 CHF per person for taking a roundtrip from Interlaken OST to Jungfraujoch, and apparently the Bern station is at walking distance from Bern’s Moxy Hotel, is this accurate?

The third day we’re planning to go to Lucerne, and the first thing to do would be going to Mt Pilatus - which seems to be year-round available, actually the reason why we didn’t plan to go to the Glacier Express (it seems closed on November).
However, I don’t know much about fares from Bern to Lucerne, and if there’s a stop that takes us to the train station or gondola to Mt Pilatus?

Finally, in the forth day we would be leaving from Bern to Paris, but in this I would also like to have a bit more of guidance on which train routes we need and what would be the best fare using the Swiss Half Fare Pass? - it seems like 2× 50lbs baggages don’t add extra cost to the ticket as far as I’ve seen train fares.

In Paris I’m not sure if there’s some sort of an equivalent to Swiss Half Fare Pass?
Also, after 4 days in Paris we would be heading back to Zurich to take our flight back.
Do you know if we can take advantage of the Swiss Half Fare Pass for our train back from Paris to Zurich?

I’m leaving this bunch questions till here.

Thank you so much for your help!

Danhiel

Guten Tag Roalloophoull18

I will answer your questions later. Today I am also travelling, I am in the Railway Museum in Utrecht (Netherlands).

Danhiel

Roalloophoull18 For Paris, could you indicate me the nearest station of metro/bus/tram from your hotel? You could need other tickets in you are in the suburbs.

Roalloophoull18

Danhiel Guten Tag!,

Thanks for reply! - hoping you have a nice trip on Netherlands!

Yeah, I’m planning to stay at: Moxy Paris Charles de Gaulle Airport.
I may be wrong, but if it’s the same as in Zurich’s airport, then there may be a train station at Charles de Gaulle’s airport, right?
So, it seems that this Moxy Paris Hotel is like 200m distance.

From there we’re planning to visit Louvre’s Museum, Eiffel Tower, those 2 and a few others at hotel’s walking distance, and hanging out one day to Disneyland Paris, but for that we need to take train.

Thanks for your help!

Danhiel

Guten Abend Roalloophoull18

I had a very nice trip and the trains were on time, I’m now in Germany for two other days.

Your hotel in Bern in near the Bern Wankdorf station, you must take a train to the Bern main station.

It is not recommended to buy tickets in advance for the Pilatus and the Jungfraujoch, the weather could be bad.

In Paris, I think that you must take the CDGVAL, an free shuttle rail service from your hotel to the railway station of CDG airport.

From Switzerland to Paris, I suggest to travel via Basel SBB - Strasbourg. You have direct TGV from Strasbourg to CDG airport and you avoid to take the metro in Paris with your baggages. Plan enough time for the connection in Strasbourg in case of a delay, because you have only a TGV to CDG every 3 hours.

You can find the rule for luggage in the TGV here:

https://www.sncf-voyageurs.com/en/travel-with-us/in-france/tgv-inoui/your-luggage-and-lockers/

From CDG airport to the center Paris, you can buy day passes. You need a card « Passe Navigo ». Ask at the ticket office, they could probably also load all the day passes for your stay on the card.

You could also use your smartphone instead of the Passe Navigo, but I never tested it. You need the card or your phone to open the gates at the entrance and the exit of the stations.

Let me known if I forgot something.

Roalloophoull18

Guten Tag Danhiel !,

Thanks for your detailed reply!
Each time I’m getting more understanding on the logistics of this trip.

Though November is not a peak season hoping that being early November there may still be orange-cladded trees - is this common by those days? - even though there may be fog and mist in the valleys, but hoping to have a little bit of sun going to the mountains.

Good to know that the train station we need is Bern’s main station instead of Bern Wankdorf (1.3mi from Bern Moxy) for going to Interlaken OST - it seems that we can take a train that connects between the two stations, right?, and does this train is covered by the Swiss Half Fare ticket?

Thanks for your advice about buying tickets in advance.
Let’s say that we arrive on Zurich’s airport, is it good enough to take a look at the weather forecast of the next day and the day after that and based on that buy the Jungrafraujoch tickets at the airport? - I know is a forecast, but not sure how accurate tends to be there?

Among other things that seem cool and enable those days is Harder Kulm’s funicular.
And it seems is in Interlaken, and operate by the same people of Jungfraujoch’s “Top of Europe”, is it accurate to guess that we should be going to Interlaken OST to hop into the funicular?

And the last day we may go to Lucerne, there’s also another funicular and cable car, plus Mount Pilatus.
Except for Mount Pilatus in case of tough weather, does the funicular and cable car operates normally there on those days?

Understood, regarding Basel SBB to Strasbourg to CDG - at all costs I want to avoid going in a metro with our baggages.
Now, for going from Bern to Basel’s train station where we can take the SBB to Strasbourg, which of the two Bern’s train stations we need to head to, Bern main station or Bern Wankdorf?

Great to know about the Navigo Passes.
I’ve read that they are kind of the train ticket passes for France, probably similar to Swiss Pass or Swiss Half Fare, etc, right?
Got it, better to get the physical card at CDG airport.

And my guess is that from CDG airport to Marriott’s Courtyard Paris (0.1mi from CDG) there may be some sort of Marriott’s shuttle, maybe?
And last on your comments, if I understood correctly you’ve said that this CDGVAL is a free shuttle service from CDG’s nearby hotel to Paris train station so that we may go by train to Disneyland, is that correct?

Once again, thank you so much for your great help!!

Danhiel

Guten Tag Roalloophoull18

From Bern Wankdorf, you have only local trains. For long-distance trains, you must first go to the Bern main station, it takes about 5 minutes. Search the timetables from Bern Wankdorf to your destination.

You could buy tickets who include the train from Bern Wankdorf to Bern main station and after the continuation to Jungfraujoch or Pilatus at every ticket office in Switzerland after your arrival (but you have no ticket office at the Bern Wankdorf station, only at the main station).

You could also but tickets only to Lucerne and Interlaken and buy the continuation at the ticket office of these stations.

You can find informations about operating dates of the Pilatus here:

https://www.pilatus.ch/en/inform/timetable

You can find the possibilities to make roundtrips here (if all lines are in service):

https://shop.e-guma.ch/pilatus-bahnen/en/tickets

The Harder Kulm Funicular operates until December, 1st. It is near the Interlaken Ost station.

In France, you have the « Carte Avantage » for 49 € who offers some reductions, you can find more informations here:

https://www.sncf-connect.com/app/en-ch/catalogue

I think that only one card were necessary:

30% discount for 1 person travelling with you

I found this information on Mariott.com:

Moxy Paris Charles De Gaulle Airport is located 200 meters from free shuttle CDGVAL connecting terminals 1,2,3 of Paris Charles De Gaulle Airport, TGV and RER station. From here, you can easily reach Disneyland Paris and Paris city center.

You can travel with the TGV from CDG airport to Disneyland Paris, but you must buy a TGV ticket and reserve seats. It is comfortable but very expensive for a 10-minutes trip.

Or you travel with the Navigo Pass via the center of Paris, it takes about 1 hour and 30 minutes.

Roalloophoull18

Guten Tag, Danhiel !,

Thanks for all these great details!
Sorry for getting back this late, no excuses, it just that there has been a lot of work and wanted to take a few minutes to carefully read and reply.

I’ve read that Uber has an expensive rate per kilometer in Switzerland, and walking distance is like 40-minutes from Bern Wankdorf Station to Bern Main Station.
Good thing from what you advised me is that practically we can go without purchasing any route ticket in advance and buy it at the station.

The only thing would be if there’s no ticket office at Bern Wankdorf, where could I get a ticket from Bern Wankdorf Station to Bern Main Station? - so that we avoid the 40-minutes walk.

One other option I was thinking is buying the Bern Wankdorf Station - Bern Main Station tickets ahead of time because for all the 3 days we would be staying at Bern Moxy Hotel, but I’m not sure if the tickets are printed with a data and hour that would give us small margin in case you got some delay, is this how it is or one buys a ticket for one day and it can be redeemed at any time during that date?

On the other hand, yes, I also found that both Jungfraujoch and Harder Kulm Cogwheel/EigerExpress and Funicular, respectively, would be available throughout November, and it’s great to have your confirmation on this!

It seems like Harder Kulm can be done in an hour, and if it’s not because Lucerne’s Mt Pilatus Cogwheel and Cable Car are resumed until November 9th we would consider going there on November 8th, but it wouldn’t be possible.
So, I need to think where are we heading next for the day before we would be going to Jungfraujoch, or probably we just interchange those dates so that while get used to trains, views, weather, etc.

On the other hand, if we decide to wait until the day of our visit to Harder Kulm, Jungfraujoch and Mt Pilatus to buy the tickets, I’ve read that lines for getting a ticket could take a long time.
Would you recommend taking a look at the cameras at Jungrafraujoch and Mt Pilatus, not sure if there’s any for Harder Kulm, and based on this decide early in the morning if buy the ticket online so that we avoid the worst case long lines to buy tickets personally?

There’s also other things we would like to do during our stay at Switzerland.
I’ve read about this nice light show at Bern’s Parliament (Bundesplatz Bern), displaying from Nov 5th all the day to December.
Is there any train from Bern Wankdorf to Bern’s Parliament at any time?
And also, how close is the ice skating ring that it seems to be near the Bundesplatz Bern?

Regarding France, let me take a closer look at the Navigo Pass vs Carte Avantage, just because of the long time, 1.5 hours, to reach Disneyland Paris from CDG Train Station, but if the cost difference is huge then probably we would do the 1.5 hours trip or even rent a car at CDG for those days in France.

I have a few more question but for now let’s leave it here.

I’m almost done with all of my questions and that’s because of your help!
Thanks a lot!

Danhiel

A correction:

30% discount for 1 person travelling with you

seems only be valid with Adult Cards, but not with Senior Cards.

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