The weirdness of the amount of fee

Ckeebauxieph18

Hello. When I was traveling from Geneva to Pont-Ceard on Thursday evening I unknowingly sat in the first class wagon. And the conductor fined me 75 franks for this without warning first. I have been travelling from Geneva to Neuchatel at least 3 times a week for more than 4 months for my masters degree and have been using the intercity trains during this time . I have never encountered such a problem before because on those trains, it’s very clear which wagons ares first class and they can be easily distinguished from the second class wagons. However, it’s not easy to make this distinction in local trains. As you can see in photos attached below. What is called first class is actually inside the second class wagon, they are interbedded and looks like 2nd class , the only difference is that there is a glass door in between.and the number 1 and 2 is written on both sides of the door. So how I’m supposed to know if it’s 1st class or 2nd? Another strange things is the amount of the fine . It is almost the same as the fine given to someone who gets on the train without a ticket ! But I had ticket . I have annual abonnement. So my mistake was sitting on a place I shouldn’t have sat, not getting on the train illegally! Therefore, if there is going to be a fine, I believe it should be a fair one by evaluating the situation fairly. I will be waiting for your answer .Thank you in advance .

RedBaron

Ckeebauxieph18
As a regular and experienced passenger, you might also have noticed for the very first time while sitting down in 1st class:

Much wider seats than in 2nd: 3 instead of the usual 4 seats per row
Seat color: Gray with red accents (e.g. headrest covers) instead of gray with the usual blue accents
Carpet flooring instead of the usual hard “plastic”
Possibly less fellow passengers around you than usual, maybe also with a more formal dress code

Which makes it hard to believe that you didn’t notice something wasn’t “normal” as with your previous approx. 50 2nd class trips.

Krist

Welcome in the SBB community. This is a users forum, and as such you will not get an official answer from SBB here. If you want to talk to someone from SBB about this you need to use the official channels for that. The document you received with the fine should mention where you can contest it.

That said. You were in the wrong. On those trains the 1st class is marked with a yellow stripe on the outside, with the numbers 1 and 2 near the doors, and the head rest of each seat is red. So it is not the case that one could easily by accident sit in 1st class. As a regular traveller you are not expected to make these kinds of mistakes.

It has become a regular issue that people sit with 2nd class tickets in the 1st class, and then, if there is no control they have enjoyed 1st class comfort at 2nd class prices. The expectation has grown amongst passengers that if they are caught with a 2nd class ticket in 1st they can just say “oh, sorry, I didn’t know” and move to second class.

SBB apparently has recently decided to no longer tolerate this. So sitting in 1st with 2nd class tickets now has consequences. I doubt that you will be able to get the fine waived.

Ckeebauxieph18

Did you check the picture attached below my message ? It would be really helpful if you could explain why there are two different numbers on both edges of the door (1 and 2 ) . And if there has to be a fee why the amount should be as high as someone who gets on the train without ticket ? It’s like giving the same punishment to different kind of crimes such as punching and stabbing . But they are not the same right ? Therefore they cannot be punished evenly . I hope I made myself clear .

Krist

Ckeebauxieph18 Did you check the picture attached below my message ?

Maybe someone replaced that sticker with the wrong one, it should indeed be a 1. Or did you take that picture form the 2nd class side?

However as you can see there are multiple signs indicating this is first class. There are also the red headrests, which have even a “1” embossed on them.

And on the outside it is clearly marked as well:

Notice the big nr. 1 on both sides of the doors, and the yellow stripes…

Ckeebauxieph18 And if there has to be a fee why the amount should be as high as someone who gets on the train without ticket ?

Well, the fine for being without a ticket is 90,- So you were fined less.

RolandP

Hello Ckeebauxieph18

Your image was taken from 2nd class viewing in direction of 1st class; behind the glass wall is the 1st class.

The 2 indicates that you are currently standing in 2nd class; there is a note at the left hand window about 1st class; it is placed at the left hand because the door to 1st class also opens at the left hand. Thus, everyone who is passing that door can see it. The same instruction is placed in 1st class. You can’t miss it.

All head rest covers in 1st class have a 1 as well.

RolandP

Hello Ckeebauxieph18

Your picture was taken from 2nd class viewing in direction of 1st class; behind the glass wall is the 1st class.

The 2 sign indicates that you are currently standing in 2nd class; there is a note at the left hand window about 1st class; it is placed at the left hand because the door to 1st class also opens at the left hand. Thus, everyone who is passing that door can see it. The same instruction is placed in 1st class. You can’t miss it.

All head rest covers in 1st class have the number 1 as well.

There is a distinction made between passengers travelling in 1st class with a 2nd class ticket but without upgrade ticket versus a passenger in 1st class without a ticket at all.

Kind regards,
Roland

Ckeebauxieph18

Thank you for the answers .